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10 November 2004 @ 04:42 pm
Um, linguisty stuff  
First off, thank you lsduncan, for being so generous and an overall awesome person. I owe you music or some DVDs- want me to send you a list you can pick from or something? ;)

And now that I have your attention, some stuff you and mqstout would most likely appreciate, hehe:

I've been looking up a lot of Farsi lately- a few awesome people know why ;) Anyway, while looking some stuff up, I notice that a lot of the words I took for granted as known are actually spelled/pronounced differently than I was taught. I wonder if that means my mom (my teacher, more or less) speaks a Farsi dialect, or if she taught me slang? She grew up in Tehran; I dunno what significance that holds.

Anyway, here are some of the differences I've found- mostly a corruption of consonants that sound alike, so maybe I'm just deaf and haven't been listening to Mom carefully all these years, lol. But anyway:

Mom's Pronunciation Formal Pronunciation Meaning (for the curious)
ashang ghashang Pretty
befarmoyeen befarmoyeed Please, by all means
shambeh shanbeh Saturday (also used to form other days of the week)
khoshkel khoshgel Beautiful
dokhdar dokhtar Girl, Daughter
var va And
 
 
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though she be but little, she is fierce: beauty (by nyoicons)golden_d on November 10th, 2004 05:20 pm (UTC)
It might be a dialect, regional pronunciation kind of thing...for instance, my mom's lost most of her North Jersey accent, but she still says things like "drownded" for "drowned", which seriously messed me up on spelling tests when I was little.
Miusheri: Feliciamiusheri on November 10th, 2004 06:50 pm (UTC)
Hehe! My mom also learned British English before American English, so there are some things I learned from her to say that get/got me weird looks. Like, don't you know that you end sentences with full stops, people? ;)
though she be but little, she is fiercegolden_d on November 11th, 2004 08:51 am (UTC)
*weird look* What's a full stop? ;)
Miusheri: Minnamiusheri on November 11th, 2004 09:55 pm (UTC)
The little dot at the end of a sentence. ;) Period.
Chia de Boskchiasmushf on November 11th, 2004 12:14 pm (UTC)
As a Minnesotan, I've got a very nasty habit of ending my sentences with prepositions. "Want to come with?"
Miusheri: Feliciamiusheri on November 11th, 2004 09:58 pm (UTC)
Pittsburghers tend to end their sentences with "n'at" (and that). Thankfully, I never acquired the habit.
ex_radric52 on November 10th, 2004 09:09 pm (UTC)
Firstly, you're quite welcome (^:3

Secondly, I can help with a few of the discreptancies from written word to spoken word.

ghashang > ashang

The velar fricative GH has been known to weaken until it's simply not pronounced anymore. (K and G are velar stops. They are pronounced with the tongue pressed against the velum, or the hard plate at the roof of the mouth. They are also stops because the air flow out of the mouth when pronouncing those sounds are "stopped" momentarily. A fricative is any sound that is produced when air is passed through a narrow space, as with the sounds F, V, S, Z, TH [as in thin], and DH [as in this])

befarmoyeed > befarmoyeen

This could be a form of nasalization. N is a dental nasal. D is a dental stop. I don't know why it would change in this case, though.

shanbeh > shambeh

The N changed into an M due to assimilation with the following B. (Assimilation is when a sound changes so that it's more akin to a sound next to it. N is a dental nasal sound, made with the teeth. B is a bilabial stop, made with the lips. M is a bilabial nasal, also made with the lips. What happened here is that the N assimilated the bilabial nature of the following B, channging it from the dental nasal N to the bilabial nasal M.)

khoshgel > khoshk

Assimilation may be at work here, too. G is a voice velar stop. K is a voiceless velar stop. SH is a voiceless palato-alveolar fricative. The G took on the voicelessness of the preceding SH, changing the sound from G to K.

dokhtar > dokhdar

Not sure about this one. It's possible that she's still pronouncing T, but it's soft enough that it's being confused with D. (English T is usually "stronger" than non-English T. However, English T is softened when preceded by an initial S, as in the difference from TOP and STOP. Say TOP. You might notice that the T is pretty strong; it's followed by a forceful ejection of air. Say STOP. It doesn't sound as strong, because it's not followed by a forceful ejection of air. It's the weaker T that may be causing some confusion, because it sounds closer to English D and because English speakers aren't used to hearing the weaker T when not following an initial S.)

va > var

This might be a "coloration" of a final A sound. Otherwise, I'm not sure why this change occured, either.
ex_radric52 on November 10th, 2004 09:12 pm (UTC)
A correction.
Oops, I meant to write khoshgel > khoshkel
ex_radric52 on November 10th, 2004 11:43 pm (UTC)
correction, part 2
*the velum, or the soft plate at the back of the roof of the mouth

gah, dunno why I got that mixed up. Velum (velar) = soft plate. Palate (palatal) = hard plate.
Miusheri: Laramiusheri on November 11th, 2004 09:59 pm (UTC)
Too cool. Thanks! Yeah, I figured it was mostly... laziness with the pronunciation, for lack of a better word ;)
ex_radric52 on November 11th, 2004 10:30 pm (UTC)
hehe, and now you know how some of that "laziness" works (^;3

--Radric, geeking with linguistics once again
(Anonymous) on February 23rd, 2005 02:38 pm (UTC)
Farsi
I pirated your farsi information and sent your mom an email using the words I learned.. thank you oh wise one!!

Love and Hugs.. Tracy