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14 September 2006 @ 03:49 pm
PETA must DIAF  
Oh good, I found it: Penn and Teller's Bullshit! episode about PETA

If you didn't already know this, PETA (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals) is a terrorist organization. They have contributed millions of dollars in aid to groups like ALF (Animal Liberation Front), who are responsible for attacks on humans in the war to make animals "free."

Huh. I thought humans were animals too, assholes.

PETA's stated goal is "total animal liberation." That means, if PETA had its way: "no pets, no meat, no milk, no zoos, no circuses, no fishing, no leather, and no animal testing for lifesaving medicines."

Sick, huh? A lot of animals are better off in captivity than they are out on the street or in the wild. Many animal biproducts don't require that we harm animals, even. And if we couldn't test medicines on animals, we'd have to start using humans. I volunteer these PETA fuckwads, personally.

And if you watch the whole video, you'll see the part about what PETA does with animals in its very own shelters.

If you're impatient, let me sum it up for you: they slaughter them.

"Sometimes the only kind option for some animals is to put them to sleep forever." - Ingrid Newkirk, head of PETA

Yup. The same people who claim Steve Irwin "abused" animals in the wild, and that his zoo and all others like it in the world should be shut down, those people are killing perfectly healthy animals left and right.

::runs off before she punches a hole through her monitor::
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Ellie: wtfellie on September 14th, 2006 08:07 pm (UTC)
Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back indeed! Clit commander anyone?
Lisa Maesielisamaesie on September 14th, 2006 08:30 pm (UTC)
While I agree with you, I have to point out that not every member of PETA is that extreme. I know a couple of people who are members, and are vegans, but they've never even minded if I eat meat in their presence. They do believe that animals should have the same rights as humans, though. But instead of forcing their opinions on others, they just refuse to have meat/animal products, or use leather, or products tested on animals, etc. (They do have a few pets, though.)

I can't watch the video or anything right now (at work), but I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it's probably just a fraction of the members who give the organization and its ideals a bad name.
Miusherimiusheri on September 14th, 2006 08:37 pm (UTC)
The problem with that is, while many of them may not be crazy whackjobs, that doesn't jive with the stated goals of the organization or its leadership. I, personally, would not lend support to a group that advocates things I believe in, but to such crazy extremes, and with the stated intent of foisting those beliefs on the rest of the world come hell or high water. When you make a donation to PETA because you like animals and don't want them to be mistreated, what you're actually funding are acts of vandalism/violence. It would be like supporting Hitler because he got the German economy going again. Even though you're not a crazy whackjob, you're supporting people who are.

(Sorry to Godwin this)
Ellie: bunnyellie on September 14th, 2006 08:44 pm (UTC)
This is why I don't give money to the Republican party, even though I support small government and states rights. And why I don't give money to the Democratic Party even though I support many of their socially progressive programs.

Actually, this is why I only give money to the Red Cross and my parish's share-fund. That way money goes to hurricane victims or people in my Church during emergencies. Really, we've paid for funerals for people and rent for a good 6 months for a family that had their home burn down.
How Random Babbling Becomes Corporate Policyt3knomanser on September 14th, 2006 09:19 pm (UTC)
This is why I don't give money to the Republican party, even though I support small government and states rights.

Wait- which Republican party are you talking about?
Ellieellie on September 14th, 2006 09:37 pm (UTC)
Well, one we haven't seen since the days of Bush Sr.
a stunning paragon of nomenclaturesemperar on September 14th, 2006 08:59 pm (UTC)
if they have pets and don't mind eating meat, they're really not dedicated 'members.' PETAs stated goals are active animal liberation. It is not a 'fraction of members,' it is the foundation of the entire organization. It IS a terrorist group. Any 'members' who don't subscribe to the ideals of PETA don't seem to understand the mission statement of what they're getting themselves into.
How Random Babbling Becomes Corporate Policy: Terroristt3knomanser on September 14th, 2006 09:33 pm (UTC)
Ironically, in the "mommy kills animals" comic, it connects "mommy"'s purchase of animal products to the killing of the very same pets PETA wants to doom to extinction.
Aikidoka, dreamer, seeker, general purpose geekmanycolored on September 14th, 2006 08:52 pm (UTC)
I don't think they ever claimed to run no-kill shelters. That's financially pretty much unfeasible. You either kill animals by putting them to sleep or you let even more of them die even more nastily by turning them away.

And I never said ALF and ELF didn't commit illegal acts. They're proud of that part. But their philosophy objects to any act that harms animal life, which includes humans in their book.

Not saying that they don't have their extremists too.

And definitely not saying I agree with PETA's extremely radical agenda. I'm more in favor of reducing the use of animal products to the level that's optimal for the environment at large (ie leather/wool/silk may be better overall than the synthetics industry, but a meat-heavy diet isn't really smart from any perspective) and humane treatment of the animals we use.
How Random Babbling Becomes Corporate Policy: Terroristt3knomanser on September 14th, 2006 09:20 pm (UTC)
In other words, you disagree with PETA.
Aikidoka, dreamer, seeker, general purpose geekmanycolored on September 14th, 2006 09:27 pm (UTC)
Well, yes, I did say that!

I also disagree with the smear campaign against PETA.
How Random Babbling Becomes Corporate Policy: johnny casht3knomanser on September 14th, 2006 09:31 pm (UTC)
Repetition of their own statements, in context, is not a smear campaign. Noting that they fund organizations that are at best dangerous and at works criminal is not a smear campaign. Pointing out the unreasonableness of their own policies, and their failure to live up to those policies due to the "unfair nature" of the world, is not a smear campaign.
Aikidoka, dreamer, seeker, general purpose geekmanycolored on September 15th, 2006 01:56 am (UTC)
Framing PETA's euthanization of animals in its shelters as equivalent to factory farming and other things they oppose is not exactly unbiased reporting, nor is snipping statements so that they are viewed apart from their context. Also, excluding the reasonable things that they say that many more moderate people would agree with.

I agree, nobody's gone so far as to say "PETA buys yellowcake from Nigeria" or "PETA group enters negotiations with Kim Jong Il to replace puppy flesh with flesh of American orphans" or "PETA president dines on foi gras; rubs hands together while watching videos of people dying from AIDS." For one thing, people are less likely to believe that kind of thing, but very likely to believe stuff about a group's corruption, greed, and twisted motives.

A few weeks ago, I did post about why I don't like veganism and other extreme viewpoints like those of PETA. I stand by that! I abhor their outright STUPIDITY. They have a severe problem with constructing their message, fail to contain the brainless among their ranks, and they tend to be religious-style zealous, a quality I revile. I do not give them money, and I don't have a membership for a reason!

But I see no reason to condemn them for euthanizing animals in their shelters. And I don't see them as any more wrong for advocating nonviolent (the only kind they do advocate) direct action than any other group that performs direct action. I sometimes hear the labor or peace movement condemned with such venom, although once they were.

Miusherimiusheri on September 15th, 2006 02:12 am (UTC)
I see no reason to condemn them for euthanizing animals in their shelters.

Neither would I, normally. But a group that openly condemns the use of euthanasia by animal shelters should not turn around and euthanize animals themselves. If they're so against it, they shouldn't be doing it. Just don't have shelters if it's an unavoidable fact of life.

nonviolent (the only kind they do advocate) direct action

Hmm... are you sure? PETA gave Rodney Coronado, an agent of the ALF and convicted arsonist, $75,000. That's the strangest way of condemning violent direct action I've ever seen, but okay...
Aikidoka, dreamer, seeker, general purpose geekmanycolored on September 15th, 2006 03:13 am (UTC)
I'm pretty sure they're pro-arson, just not pro-arson of buildings that there are people in.

Again, another reason why I don't belong, donate money, or encourage anybody else to.
a stunning paragon of nomenclaturesemperar on September 14th, 2006 09:03 pm (UTC)
holy shit, bill maher is a PETA spokesguy? how did that happen?
a stunning paragon of nomenclaturesemperar on September 14th, 2006 09:04 pm (UTC)
also, remind me what DIAF is.

repetetive comments a-go-go!
Miusherimiusheri on September 14th, 2006 09:06 pm (UTC)
DIAF = Die In A Fire (see: Fark)

Bill Maher? Damn... they also have Bea Arthur. I wonder if these people even read the whole PETA platform before jumping on the bandwagon.
How Random Babbling Becomes Corporate Policyt3knomanser on September 14th, 2006 09:21 pm (UTC)
Probably not. Bea Arthur doesn't need to read- she's older than words.
pine_island on September 15th, 2006 03:26 am (UTC)
*hangs head* I am ashamed to say that I once donated to them several years ago. In my own defense, I was ignorant of their tactics at the time. But still, knowing now what I do, I am ashamed.

Needless to say they have not gotten any more of my money since that one-time donation (which wasn't too much, I don't think - somewhere between $20 - 50).
Miusherimiusheri on September 15th, 2006 04:15 am (UTC)
Hey, no biggie. A lot of people have the wrong impression of them for one thing, and for another, not one of us is infallible ^_^

Say hi/pet your kitties for me! =D